Law & Medicine: The Intersection of Personal Autonomy and Public Safety with Dr. William T. Choctaw MD, JD, and Esq. Bernie Brown, JD

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Coming up on this episode of the
Healthy, Wealthy and Wise podcast.

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I've got, I've got one more parting
question for, this is for both of you.

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Um, how do you think, uh, the, uh, legal
and medical communities can, uh, uh,

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collaborate, uh, to safeguard democracy?

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In my opinion, vote.

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Gotta vote.

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Yeah.

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Um, the legal and medical, did you say?

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Yes, sir.

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Oh man, that's a stumper.

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That's a good one.

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I think he's right.

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It's just a one point
answer, a one word answer.

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And that's for everybody to go out and
vote and make your, your positions known.

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Yeah.

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And kind of the basis of
their question is that.

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Welcome to the Healthy, Wealthy,
and Wise podcast with Dr.

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William T.

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Choctaw, MD, JD.

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This podcast will inform, educate,
and motivate you to live a more

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healthy, wealthy, and wise life.

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It's powered by the over 50 years of
medical experience of this Yale University

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Medical School trained surgeon, who
also received his Juris Doctorate.

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from Western State Law School.

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He has executive experience as a
former mayor of Walnut, California,

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as a chairman of the nonprofit
Servants Arms, and as president of

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Choctaw Medical Group, Incorporated.

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You've got questions or concerns.

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He's got answers for both.

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So let's listen in on an
interview already in progress.

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Great.

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All right.

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Jess, do you have any
questions for, um, brother?

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Um, actually, um, I'm going to try to get
through maybe, you know, not necessarily

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20 questions, but you know, about 10
questions, but I have a, uh, just a

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point of information on perspective,
I guess, maybe Bernie's perspective.

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Uh, is due to the fact of his
experience in the courtroom

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and the discovery process.

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That's true, I've been in
the operating room too much.

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That's true, we've operated in different

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amphitheaters.

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And also, uh, there was a famous or
infamous, uh, politician that, uh, Uh,

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that got probably a lot of them, but
recently got elected based on lies,

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but the long arm of the law caught up.

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Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes,
they kicked him out.

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They kicked him out.

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So it does work on occasion.

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So one of the questions that I have for
you, brother Bernie is, uh, how do you

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see the current state of the legal system
affecting democracy in the United States?

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Well, I think the system is still
strong and I think the system is still

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vibrant and I think the system is
largely, for the most part, still fair.

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Now there are certain issues
with regard to the system.

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Uh, as we see, um, if you can
load the courts with judges that

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have a certain perspective that's
consistent with your political

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opinion, then that can have an effect.

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I mean, I do believe that Trump
effectively loaded the Supreme

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court, the U S Supreme court.

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And the result is, you know,
with regard to like abortion.

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And certain other legal issues,
a reversal of precedence.

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Mm-Hmm, . So certainly it can have
an effect, but overall I think the

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institutions, uh, are, are, are strong.

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And I think, uh, even in dealing
with, everyday with police

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officers, with uh, politicians.

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With governmental officials, with
prosecutors, with defense lawyers,

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everybody from what I can see,
they actually have their heart

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pretty much, mostly everybody, has
their heart in the right place.

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They have a different perspective on
how to achieve their ultimate goal.

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But their heart is pretty
much good and clear.

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So I think the system is still
foundationally strong and secure, but it's

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still subject, in my opinion, to deception
and manipulation, which many people

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believe occur through money and power.

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and influence and media.

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But, uh, so, yeah.

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Okay.

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Doctor, uh, from a historical
perspective, what parallels do you

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see between, uh, current threats
to democracy and past, uh, crises?

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Well, I

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think to, to, um, um, agree with what,
uh, Attorney Brown just said, I think

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the, the current threats are much greater.

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Uh, because we have an actor that
we've never had before, certainly

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I've never seen in my lifetime.

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Um, and what's unique about this
particular actor is that he has

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been able to give weaker leaders
permission to do bad things and

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not Um, and be okay with it.

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Um, and so I, I think that that, that,
that makes it more serious, but having

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said that I, I do believe in democracy
and I do believe that those founding

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fathers back in the 1700s had a good idea.

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And, um, we just have to do our part.

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We, we, the people, we, the
majority, um, and we have to

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vote and we have to work hard.

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Freedom is not free.

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And we, we all know that, uh, voter
suppression and all that's been around,

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um, way back with the poll taxes in
Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi, you

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know, and closing the polls and all
the other shenanigans that people try.

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If you know what's coming now,
maybe you can't stop all of them,

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but you can stop a lot of them.

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And, um, I think with the right candidate,
and I do believe the president candidate

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is the right candidate, and I think
that's something unique and special,

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uh, about the fact that she is a woman.

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You know, I, I think, I remember
when, when the thing happened to

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the ex president and they said,
Oh, this is, you know, the, he

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survived and all that sort of stuff.

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I think that that's the flip side of that.

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And the flip side was, well,
you thought Obama was something.

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You thought Obama was unique.

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Guess what I got for you now?

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You ain't seen nothing yet.

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And I think that this is part
of that prophecy, you know, and

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there may be others beyond Kamala.

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You know, so sort of like, uh, I think
it was Michelle at the convention.

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She said, well, you know, I guess
he just has trouble with successful

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blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,
uh, uh, people who happen to be black.

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Uh, and then she mentioned
about the black job, you know?

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So my point is that I think that
there's a positive message in all of

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this that I never first saw coming.

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I, I, and I've been following
politics most of my life.

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Um, I didn't foresee Kamala.

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Um, but I think, I think
she's the real deal.

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I, you know, and I said, I, I, you know,
instead of, instead of going to, uh,

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Western College, I should have gone up
north and made an application to Hastings.

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That's where all, that's where the
cream of the crop is coming from.

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Well,

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well, keeping, keeping with messaging,
uh, This is for both of you.

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What role do you think, uh, misinformation
and disinformation, uh, play in

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eroding, uh, democratic values?

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You want to go first?

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No, I'll let you take that one.

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Oh, I think it's like, Oh, like 50 percent
or more, you know, there's all this false.

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There's so many false
narratives out there.

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I agree.

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They just say whatever they
want to say and they blame,

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you know, it's the blame game.

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Yeah.

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It's the name calling game.

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It's the, I can do this when, when you
can't do it, you know, and it's just,

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it plays, I think, a significant role.

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in the whole process, because if you
can get people to believe terrible

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things about your opponent, even
though they may be false, then you

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can, to some degree, you control the
narrative and you can produce voting.

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Votes you can generate votes
based on a false pretense

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And I think the mainstream media is
either unwilling or unable to police that

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or call it out for whatever reason, um,
you know, because they Put themselves

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out to be the guardians of democracy
and that sort of thing But I think they

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failed on that, you know, they they
they fall into the whole idea of Ratings

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and money and all that sort of stuff.

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Um real quick before we let you
go I remember there was a guy on

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MSNBC, Lawrence O'Donnell, he's
one of my favorite commentators.

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He just had an absolute fit about two
weeks ago, because the ex president had a

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news conference at his club in Mar a Lago,
and obviously, and the questions they

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asked were, you know, they was ex softball
questions, they didn't ask him anything.

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Um, and, and at the same time, Kamala
had a, had a, had a, uh, an event

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that the networks didn't even show,
didn't even talk about that much.

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And he thought that was horrible.

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And he sort of called them out about it.

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So my point is, I think our media has,
has been, um, uh, taken over to some

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extent by the ratings and all that
and, and, and the ex president will

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get you ratings cause he's going to say
something stupid, you know, then people

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can talk about that for a week, you know?

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Um, and I think that that, that
makes your point, Bernie, even

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stronger, uh, because I think that.

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a lot of those things
have to be corrected.

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It's not just one thing.

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It's a number of different things that
have to be corrected to keep us safe.

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I've got, I've got one more parting
question for, this is for both of you.

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Um, how do you think, uh, the, uh,
legal and medical communities can

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collaborate, can, uh, collaborate,
uh, to safeguard democracy?

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In my opinion, vote.

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Got to vote.

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Yeah.

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Um, the legal and medical, did you say?

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Yes, sir.

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Oh man, that's a stumper.

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That's a good one.

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I think he's right.

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It's just a one point
answer, a one word answer.

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And that's for everybody
to go out and vote.

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And make your, your positions known.

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Yeah, and kind of the basis of that
question is that, uh, there is an

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intersection between law and medicine
as it relates to democratic rights,

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personal autonomy versus public safety.

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And so that was kind of
the basis of that question.

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Okay.

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I think it's certainly one of the things
that I learned, um, uh, going to law

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school is how important all that was.

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And I didn't appreciate just, just
that, you know, in terms of the justice

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point, I didn't appreciate how much
the law was involved with medicine.

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I mean, I knew about
malpractice, but that's just.

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One very, very unique area.

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Uh, there's so many things that have to do
with safety, uh, you know, patient safety.

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Uh, I think it's a huge part of
that in terms of institutional

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responsibility, physician responsibility,
team responsibility, et cetera.

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Um, and I think that's why we,
we need those laws and, and

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that protect people's rights.

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You know, physicians have a duty to
inform, but patients have a right to

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refuse, um, but patients can't exercise
those rights that they don't know about.

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know what they are, uh, type thing.

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So I think, I think there, there,
there are a number of connections.

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We have a long way to go.

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Um, uh, but I think part of
that is getting the right

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leaders in, in the White House.

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Yes, because one of them, uh,
has threatened to withhold, uh,

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federal funding to schools that,
uh, authorize vaccinations,

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you know, for, I know, I know.

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Bernie, you were going to make a point.

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Well, uh, getting to the point that
you just made about authorizing

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vaccinations and getting involved in
that, the law can be involved in, uh,

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protecting society, but generally you
want the law to be on the right side.

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Law is intricately involved in medicine.

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That's part of the whole issue
with regard to abortion rights and

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medical malpractice and standards.

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And so the law is very, very
involved in that whole issue.

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And with regard to vaccinations,
I mean, it was really a wonderful

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thing when the vaccinations came out.

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Yes.

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The law did not.

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require people to get the vaccination.

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Nobody said you are forced to
do that, which the conspiracy

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theorists were going to happen.

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Yes.

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It didn't happen.

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So we still have to have personal
liberties, but we do have

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to protect society at large.

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And so we have to look to
both, uh, both positions.

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That is what is best for society at large.

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And in the case of vaccines, it is
actually would have been better if

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everybody took the vaccine, but it was
great to make it available to everybody.

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But, uh, uh, so the law is always involved
and they're always intermingled, but we

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try To not, uh, through the law, force
people to do things that they don't want

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to do because we live in a free society.

230
00:14:11,405 --> 00:14:11,925
Indeed.

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00:14:12,715 --> 00:14:14,964
Well, listen, Brother Brown,
we're going to let you go.

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00:14:15,185 --> 00:14:19,854
Thank you so much for, again, your,
your precious time and everything.

233
00:14:20,144 --> 00:14:21,344
Um, yes.

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00:14:21,594 --> 00:14:22,324
Oh, I'm just saying.

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God bless you both and thank you,

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00:14:25,710 --> 00:14:25,920
.
Thank you.

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00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:26,355
Alright, take care.

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00:14:26,465 --> 00:14:26,955
Alright.

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00:14:27,570 --> 00:14:30,795
Thank you for listening to the Healthy,
wealthy and Wise Podcast with Dr.

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00:14:30,795 --> 00:14:33,330
William t Choctaw, MDJD.

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00:14:33,810 --> 00:14:37,650
You can listen again to this and
any of the previous episodes.

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00:14:37,890 --> 00:14:45,720
Leave a comment or pose questions to
the doctor by going to www.twp.com.

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00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:50,340
That's www.thwwp.com.

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00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:55,050
It's also available wherever
you get your podcasts.

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00:14:55,950 --> 00:14:59,819
Be sure to follow, like, share, and
subscribe if you haven't already.

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00:15:00,070 --> 00:15:02,980
Then tune in for the next
episode of the Healthy, Wealthy,

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00:15:02,980 --> 00:15:04,570
and Wise podcast with Dr.

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00:15:04,570 --> 00:15:05,119
William T.

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Choctaw, M.

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D., J.

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D.

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